[?] Subscribe To The Bookkeeping Blog

XML RSS
Add to Google
Add to My Yahoo!
Add to My MSN
Subscribe with Bloglines

Home
The Support
The Site Map

The Tea Break
The Tea Shoppe
The Virtual eGuide
The Online Exams
The Excel Lessons
The Free Ezine
The Forum
The Blog

The Receipts Organization
The Filing eBook
The Scanning
The Vehicle System
The Suggestions

The Tax - Canada
The CRA Compliance
The CRA News
The Small Biz News
The GST HST
The CRA Tax
The T2125 Form

The Tax - U.S.
The IRS News
The Payroll Taxes
The Rates & Dates

The Bookkeeping
The Basics
The Practice
The Training
The System
The Plan
The Tips
The Help

The Back Office
Contact/Meet Me
Hire Me
Site Policies

GST/HST $30,000 Threshold

by Anthony
(Toronto)

How does the $30,000 GST/HST rule actually work for a sole proprietor with employees?


If a sole proprietor's company takes in $200K in sales, but pays most of that out to employees as payroll + overhead fees, and the actual profit for the sole proprietor is less than $30k, does this mean he or she does not have to collect HST?

If the profit for the sole proprietor, is above $30k, does this mean he or she only has to charge on the sales that generated profit over $30k?

The question with an example scenario:

If I, even though sales were $200k, only actually make $70k in personal profit, does this mean I only have to remit HST for sales that generated beyond $30k of personal profit (which in the case is also $40k)?

To add more details to the question: the first segment in sales ($0 to $90k) turned up a profit for the sole proprietor of less than $30k; yet, sales from the 2nd sales segment ($90,000.01 to $200k) generated added profit for the sole proprietor over the original $30k (again, in this case, $40k... so $70k total profits before taking away what is supposed to be remitted as HST).

Does that mean the sole proprietor would only need to collect tax on sales made in the second segment?



image of fancy scroll lines



Hello Anthony,

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news ...

If you look at the CRA publication RC4022 General Information for GST/HST Registrants, you will see that GST/HST registration is mandatory when your taxable sales meets or exceeds the $30,000 threshold.

This threshold is not based on net profit ... but taxable sales.

I think you are confusing this a bit with how sole proprietors' income is taxed ... which is net profit.

GST/HST is a neutral tax to business, and actually reduces your total taxes (sales tax and income tax).

You can find the rules for mandatory GST/HST registration in my article on GST/HST in The Tax section.



Anthony, you should be aware that if you do not officially register and start collecting the sales tax when you meet the $30,000 threshold, you will lose your input tax credits ... OUCH that hurts you directly in your pocket book!

It will also place on CRA's non-compliance radar ... and you will likely be monitored more closely ... for years!

Also keep in mind that new place of supply rules went into effect on May 1, 2010. The sales tax rate you collect is no longer based on your location.

You can find information about your GST/HST deadlines and the GST/HST rates by province in my tax compliance section.


I hope this helps you understand the tax compliance rules regarding GST/HST Anthony. If you have any more questions after following each link I have provided, please post back here.

Comments for
GST/HST $30,000 Threshold

Click here to add your own comments

Jul 28, 2010
Thank you for the feedback...
by: Anthony

First my company was PST exempt, but now I have to worry about 13% on total sales.

I actually have almost no input for HST to claim, as most of the money goes out to employees; therefore, I will have to raise my rates to retain the same level of profit, or be willing to accept less profit overall for the same amount of work.

I hate the HST.

Jul 28, 2010
HST is a neutral tax to your business
by: Bookkeeping Essentials

Anthony,

Maybe I'm missing something here, but ...

The HST will result in an 8% price increase for your non-commercial customers / clients ... but because you will no longer have your PST expenses included with your operating expenses, your net profit increases ... unless you feel your non-commercial customers/clients will purchase less of your services ... or you reduce your prices by 8% so your non-commercial customer is paying the same amount as before.

All your business/commercial customers get to claim the input tax credit, so it has no effect on them.

The thing is, all your competitors are in the same place, so the tax should not result in a loss of business to competitors.

Prior to HST, the PST costs you did have could not be recouped. Now you get to claim them through your input tax credits and get your money back. This puts more cash in your pocket ... and reduces your income taxes to be paid.

When the no smoking laws in pubs and bars came into effect, every bar owner was sure they were going to go out of business. As far as I know, there are still bars ... and people still frequent them.


Oct 11, 2010
Clarification
by: Anonymous

Hi,

I just wanted to point out one statement that "Bookkeeping Essentials" had stated which is not correct:


"All your business/commercial customers get to claim the input tax credit, so it has no effect on them."

Only the Business / commercial customers that are GST/HST registered will get to claim the ITC.

A lot of small businesses are not registered!

Oct 12, 2010
Voluntary GST HST Registration
by: Bookkeeping Essentials

That is an excellent and valid point ... and thank you for pointing it out.

However, if a small business is not registered, they have the option to voluntarily register prior to the $30,000 threshold. This option is available to all businesses.

It is the business owner's choice to forego collecting input tax credits (ITCs) that would make the sales tax neutral to them.

I may be missing something because I've never understood why a business would choose to not claim ITCs. My understanding is that GST/HST registrants pay less tax.

Thank you once again for bringing this point up.


Oct 12, 2010
Option to register / not to register for HST/GST
by: CParks

Most small businesses who are selling or providing taxable goods or services and are under the $30,000 threshhold that choose not to register for the GST/HST usually make the choice not to register based on the extra burden to keep track of the HST collected and HST paid.

They sometimes feel it may open the door for possible HST audits. Some feel also that they will lose customers by charging an extra 13%. (If they are selling to the public.)

Businesses that provide services usually do not have a significant amount of ITCs to claim.

These are not my arguments, I am simply stating the reasoning behind most small busineses that do not register when its optional.

Basically, they feel the effort is not worth the ITCs they they will be claiming.

May 03, 2011
about $30,000
by: Anonymous

Question:

I already registered and got a HST number last year because my sales were over $30,000.

When should I start to collecting HST this year? from the beginning, the first transaction or from when my sales are over $30,000 this year?

May 03, 2011
Sales Tax on Sales
by: Lake

Hi,

Once you are a GST/HST registrant, you must collect GST/HST on every sale according to place of supply rules.

Nov 09, 2011
HST $10,000 Annual Sales
by: George, Toronto

Should I be billing the company I consult with HST when I only make $10,000 yearly and I do not have many expenses?

Nov 09, 2011
Consider Voluntary Registration
by: Lake

Hi George,

I moved your submission to a GST/HST page that already existed.

If you are not a GST/HST registrant with CRA, then you do NOT charge / collect GST/HST.

You may, however, want to consider voluntarily registering for HST. Click here to read more on this topic.


Dec 28, 2011
Virtually NO ITC to claim
by: Olga

Here is one good example of services with virtually no ITC to claim:

truck-driving services by a self-employed individual (not an owner-operator). Once you hit #30000 in sales you have to start charging HST; meanwhile as a driver using the company's truck you have virtually no expenses to claim (not even meal for short haul), therefore no ITC to be used against HST.

$30,000 mark looks ridiculosly low nowadays; even very small businesses collect more; otherwise why bother; just a remark ;)



section divider



Hmmm, I'm not familiar with the trucking industry, but here's my questions Olga.

If the trucker is self-employed, why is he driving someone else's equipment? Does he actually meet CRA's criteria for self-employed - written contract, multiple clients, control over what is done, when and how it is done, ownership of tools, financial risk and opportunity for profit? Is the business owner just trying to reduce payroll taxes by classifying the worker as self-employed rather than as an employee?

Jan 29, 2012
Confused About HST's Threshold
by: Michelle

I'm just wondering if you can answer a question for me.

I was making over $30,000 (as a hairdresser in my home) and have been collecting and paying HST quarterly for the past couple years. This year I had a baby and my income has dropped down to about $20,000.

For 2011, I was paying my HST quarterly, but now I am wondering if, because my income is now less then $30,000, will I be get an HST refund? Do I un-register my HST number?



section divider



Hi Michelle,

Once you are registered for HST, you continue to file, even if your income drops below the $30,000 threshold. You would only get a refund if your ITCs were greater than your HST collected. If you use the Quick Method of Accounting for HST, you will never receive an actual refund because the refund rate is built into the Quick rate.

You could close your HST account, but there is some settling up (returning) of ITCs previously claimed that are no longer elgible for the credit. (Follow the link for more information on this.)

If you expect your income to pick up again over the $30,000 threshold, you might not want to bother closing your HST account.

Jan 31, 2012
not registered and over the 30M for the year
by: Jeanne

What happens if for the year you have sales revenue of approximately $50,00; reaching over the $30,000 threshold in September? I registered for HST in January; am I responsible for HST from September on? or for the whole year?



section divider



Please see my chat on Mandatory GST/HST Registration.

Click here to add your own comments


SIMPLE EASY
Office Filing System


Learn How to Organize Files
In Under 30 Minutes

$47

Bookkeeping In A Box eBook- choose the Canadian or US Version

Download eBook Canadian

Download eBook U.S.



You can delegate responsibility but you can't abdicate it!




2 Bookkeeping Tests
Prescreening Tool or Study Aid
350 Questions

includes answer key,
Bookkeeping Basics Webcast
and more

Bookkeeping Test Questions and Answers Bookkeeping Test Online Basic Bookkeeping Training

$49 USD
LIFETIME ACCESS

Click on exam booklet to order
Click here for more information

How to Use This Exam:

(1) As part of your interview process when hiring a bookkeeper.

(2) To self assess your bookkeeping skills.

(3) As a practise test before writing your bookkeeping certification exam.




Learn How to Turn
Your Piles of Paper
Into an Organized
Electronic System

Paperless Document Organization Guide

Click on the picture above
for easy to understand tips and strategies on how to go paperless.




Free eReport When You
Subscribe To My Newsletter
The Bookkeeper's Notes

eBook cover




Subscribe To
The Bookkeeper's Notes
A Free Newsletter

For The Work From Home Business Owner

Email

Name

Then

Don't worry -- your e-mail address is totally secure. I promise to use it only to send you The Bookkeeper's Notes.




Brian Tracy's

Click here to receive Brian Tracy's Free Goal Setting Success Guide!





(Listed Under Websites NOT Under Local Business. This website is not associated with any business operating in Bonnyville Alberta.)




From the Mail Bag
Visitor Comments



Thanks for the information. It is nice to see there is an online site where I can go get answers to my bookkeeping questions. It was really a stroke of luck I came across this site. I googled my bookkeeping question to see if I could get an answer, a shot in the dark, and bookkeeping-essentials was one of the results listed. I looked over some other sites but none were as flexible as this site. I got a quick response and I will be using this site in the future. Thanks again.

Bayside, NY, United States




I love your site...its very homey!!! It's like reading/talking to a friend!! Thanks!!

Kim, Jackson, MS United States




Your website is positively BRILLIANT! I don't care at all for the numbers side of my business, but you've made it interesting, fun, comfortable--downright enjoyable! Bite-sized WELL WRITTEN bits walking me through fundamentals, encouraging me, explaining.(Note: "well written" covers everything from "interesting" to "intelligent." The reader doesn't stumble over elementary grammar errors, lots of typos, etc.) I've only just discovered this lovely gold mine!

Cherie, U.S.




I have just come across your site and it's great...thank you so much for the time it must take you to compile the data and information. I have no accountancy or book keeping knowledge and am currently trying to learn QuickBooks via YouTube. (lol) There must be an easier way as I don't have the time or finances, what with starting a new business, to attend a course at college or similar.

Debbie, Vancouver, BC Canada




As a novice at the bookkeeping game, this site has become my go to site for research. Thank you for the great resource. I do my data entry one or twice a year (very low volume) and I find I need retraining on Quickbooks for things like depreciation/CCA.

Den, St. Albert, AB Canada




A More Than FANTASTIC site! So often I've thought about putting something together like your site, but didn't have the time. Googling information about Supplies or Tools over under $500.00 was the most useful Google search I've ever done because of discovering your site. Way to go and THANKS VERY MUCH. PS.... Also loved it that you put the Tax chart for GST HST back to 1997; I spent hours trying to get this information from the CRA website. I've not had time to look at your whole site, but I will be refering to it often I'm sure and will mention anything I think is missing, should I not discover information as I might be looking for it. Thanks, Again

Leona, Sicamous, BC Canada




Thank you for your comprehensive reply to my question. I really appreciate the time you took to explain it to me.

Connie, Canada




This is an absolutely awesome site! I am not lying. I went to Chapters to try to find something just like this and they did not have what I was looking for - which your site does ... which is good definitions and explanations. I am going to book mark this page if that's okay. ... Great job and thank you. I will definitely use this resource.

PK Lethbridge, Alberta




My biggest problem in doing my books is keeping debits & credits straight in liability and equity accounts. I really liked the cheat sheet. (I think that will help me keep the debits and credits straight.)

Lisa, Williston, USA




Lake you're awesome in every way. I have had some insight about how to properly classify some accounts.

Karim, Calgary, Alberta




Thank you so much for this website. I am interviewing for my first bookkeeping position in over 10 years--and my first in Canada. I have AAS degrees in Accounting and Business Admin from the US but have never worked in "my field" since immigrating in 2000. Your website makes me feel more confident I can actually do the job I am interviewing for. So far, I have been refreshing my knowledge and preparing for a job interview. I've bookmarked the site for WHEN I get the job!

Robin, Toronto, ON




I love your website. Just love it.

Carolann
CPB Bookkeeping, Inc.
"The Organizer"
Lake Worth, FL




I posted a question on Accumulated Surplus and you asked me to comment on your comments. I really appreciated reading what you posted and it did help. Especially the part of talking to the accountant. That really makes sense. I find more and more that I interact with the accountants to keep on learning. Love Love Love your website. Just discovered it about 3 weeks ago and have been on it lots since then.

Jan
Red Deer, Alberta




Wow. I'm so thankful to have stumbled across your site, with the assistance of Google. :) I love your style of writing, your approach, and your message. Thank you for your time and efforts. In a nutshell, your light humor and simple approach is refreshing and uplifting.

Kathy, Hillsdale, United States




Your site is great by the way. I just came across it.

Trish, Canada




Thanks for responding so quickly ... I really appreciate all the forum help ... I do Love the forum and have looked through other questions on it and feel it will greatly help in the future. Your site is fantastic and I will recommend it to anyone asking about bookkeeping help.

Cindy, Calgary, Canada




It (your site) is very helpful and thank you for your tips and advice. I am so glad I found your site.

Lee, Calgary, Alberta




Thank you so much for your hard work on your site ... I find I learn quicker and easier with you than I did with courses. Your site has helped my knowledge, learning new things and with the explanation of terms/items. Keep up the good "BookWORK"!

Naomi, Balance Your Books, Squamish, B.C.




This website has been very helpful. It's been too many years since school and I'm a bit rusty.

Sue, Medicine Hat, Alberta




I just found this site tonight. It's going to help me a lot as I learn how to use my Quickbooks more fully (I've only used it for payroll). Don't ask me how I've managed to keep the books this long -5 years- without knowing much more than how to balance a checkbook. I'm getting some help from a professional now, but your site will keep my pro costs down. Thank you. I will definitely donate once I begin to use it with my QuickBooks. It's [your site] easier to understand than Help in QuickBooks. QuickBooks assumes I know bookkeeping concepts. It [your site] appears to be very thorough, though I've only scratched the surface of what I can learn. I took an online bookkeeping class a couple of years ago, but this site has direct application to quickbooks and it's a searchable site!

Ruth, Dos Palos, CA USA




Thank you for providing valuable information regarding home business taxes on this website.

U.C., Toronto, Canada




I started my own bookkeeping business two years ago and enjoy your site. I literally grab my cup of coffee and look around for hours. :D It's a wonderful site with loads of information and I'm all about learning from my peers who might have the answers to some of the questions I may have. Keep up the good work. :)

Tania, TaniasBookkeeping.org
Taking the worry away
Belledune, New Brunswick




BTW, did you say Bookkeeping? Cuz I fell asleep... just kidding!

Dr. Julia
www.advice-with-dr-julia.com

(I love her humour!)




Absolutely a great site! I have often dreamed of having a similar site but figured I might have to wait until I retire to get the time. I have bookmarked this site and will return again.

C.H.
Alwyn Enterprises
Scarborough , Ontario




You have a wonderful website. Thank you so much for letting me know you have one now. [It] is really well done and very, very informative. Also really charming.

R.P.
Reliable Recordkeeping
Toronto, Ontario




I'm enjoying reading your blog! Thought I'd drop you a quick note of encouragement.

Loralee, Red2Black.ca
QuickBooks "one
on one" coaching
Edmonton, Alberta




This is a marvelous site and one that I would like to use as the basis for training bookkeepers. I am a CPA here in the states and am in the process of building a what will hopefully become a substantial bookkeeping business (not a dark wood & gold lettered CPA firm). I want to serve the small business owner with the day to day service they need. You have obviously put in an enormous amount of time and effort here (there is no doubt there) and provide a wealth of fantastic information.

R. Keith Pierce, CPA, P.A.
I'll Sweat The Small Stuff For You - JaxTaxPro.com
Jacksonville, Florida